Electrical question, setting up a fuse block.

[Muleears]

I plan to add some accessories to my bike so I am attempting to install a fuse block. Please, no laughing, I am NOT an electrician! Usually I end up like this . So instead I am calling on the collective expertise of this forum to guide me.

Here is a pic of what I have done so far (remember, no laughing)



Currently (pun intended) there is no fuse in the power feed to the fuse block. Does what I have done look correct? I have a fused power supply from the positive side of the battery to the input on the fuse block. So far so good? I realize none of these taps will be switched. Should I draw power from another source that is switched? If so, where would I find it? I plan to run two 27 watt accessory lights, a GPS and a usb iPhone charger from this block. Am I nuts?

Please share with me my errors (and pardon the crappy graphics in the pic). If my high school physics teacher (forgive me Mr. Ferguson) taught me anything, what I have proposed should draw 6 or 7 amps. Correct? If that is the case, the fuse I put in the power supply line should only be a little bit more, say 10 amps. Correct?
OK, I think that's enough for now. Please, point me in the right direction

[doug of so fla]

Is there a connection for a ground??

[Muleears]

Is there a connection for a ground??

I wondered about that too, but there is not. Just the one post, that I assumed (right or wrong) was the positive terminal. The only other connections are the spade terminals.

[Tat2demon]

Looks right to me. The ground should be provided through whatever you're powering.

[debron]

The ground should be provided through whatever you're powering.

Ditto

[Muleears]

Thanks fellas. If I want to power my pair of 27 watt lights, I assume I should use a relay of some sort? Or just use heavy enough wire and switch to support the amps? Ideally I would like to wire them into the high beam switch so they are on with my high beams. In that case I would have to use a relay that gets a signal from the high beam circuit to turn on correct? I'm just thinkin' here, not sure what I'm gonna do yet. I obviously know little about wiring such things. Usually when I do I end up doing this and then

[debron]

I want to power my pair of 27 watt lights. . . . ideally I would like to wire them into the high beam switch so they are on with my high beams. In that case I would have to use a relay. . .

The answer is in your own words!

[SgtSlag]

For running lights, I would recommend high-power LED's, instead of filament bulbs. There are bicycle headlights which pump out 1,800 Lumens (Low Beam headlight is in the 700 Lumen range), while drawing only 10 Watts -- use two, and you get 3,600 Lumens for only 20 Watts. Check out the Lumen output of the 27 Watt filament lights, to see how little bang you will get for your wattage.

The LED's cost a bit, but they're vibration-proof, waterproof, and easy to use. They can usually handle 12 Volts, as they are current devices which can accept a fairly wide voltage range. They're inexpensive enough to replace should they take a rock hit. I've had two 3 Watt LED running lights on mine for 2+ years, over 5,000 miles, no issues.

Here is a great book which will answer many of your questions, as well as going beyond. It does a great job explaining the whole thing, basics, plus adding a second fuse block, accessories, and how to calculate how much additional wattage your alternator can supply: link on Amazon.

Check for it at your local library (how I was able to read it). The ISBN's are as follows: ISBN-10: 0760327165; ISBN-13: 978-0760327166. It does a good job explaining how electrical systems work. I am a professional computer technician, trained as an electronic technician, years ago. I knew most of it already, but it provided a good review, and I believe it is comprehensible for most laymen, as well. I liked it so much, I hope to get a copy for my library in a few months, just to have a great resource at hand. Cheers!

[Chris near Kansas City]

Ditto what has already been said, though I prefer a little heavier wire/cable from the battery to the aux fuse block. I do tend to over-build things sometimes. Think of electricity like water. If you want to run water through 2 or 3 or 4 things, you have to make sure the main can handle all those branches.



Wiring the lights so that the high beam triggers a relay isn't a bad idea. But I prefer to have the choice on when and where each light on my bike is turned on. I'd also recommend a voltmeter, but if the lights are only 27 watts, then you'll probably have nothing to worry about. A standard 55 watt set of lights will take half a volt right off the top of the V12's barely adequate charging system while running down the highway. And that's without the high beam on.

I typically use the accessory leads as the "ignition on" trigger for my relays. The only exception would be a 12volt plug somewhere on the bike wired directly to the battery (fused of course) for air compressor or emergency situation where you don't want to have the bike's ignition on for 10 minutes. Also, that you wouldn't likely leave something plugged into it and turned on only to run the battery down.

If you run a fuse holder between the battery and aux fuse block, then it will need to be rated for whatever the total number of amps for the accessories you'll be adding. Otherwise, you may not be able to run all the added accessories without either blowing the fuse, or overloading the fuse holder itself. Since the fuse block is only rated to 30 amps, then your 30 amp fuse holder should suffice as long as your planned additions won't total more draw than that.

[Muleears]

For running lights, I would recommend high-power LED's, instead of filament bulbs. There are bicycle headlights which pump out 1,800 Lumens (Low Beam headlight is in the 700 Lumen range), while drawing only 10 Watts -- use two, and you get 3,600 Lumens for only 20 Watts. Check out the Lumen output of the 27 Watt filament lights, to see how little bang you will get for your wattage.

The LED's cost a bit, but they're vibration-proof, waterproof, and easy to use. They can usually handle 12 Volts, as they are current devices which can accept a fairly wide voltage range. They're inexpensive enough to replace should they take a rock hit. I've had two 3 Watt LED running lights on mine for 2+ years, over 5,000 miles, no issues.

I agree SgtSlag, the lights I have are hi power LED's, 2150 lumens each. They only draw 2.25 amps per lamp, for a total of 4.5 amps for 4300 lumens of light. There are many deer in my neck of the woods. I don't want to take any chances!

[Muleears]

Ditto what has already been said, though I prefer a little heavier wire/cable from the battery to the aux fuse block. I do tend to over-build things sometimes. Think of electricity like water. If you want to run water through 2 or 3 or 4 things, you have to make sure the main can handle all those branches.



Wiring the lights so that the high beam triggers a relay isn't a bad idea. But I prefer to have the choice on when and where each light on my bike is turned on. I'd also recommend a voltmeter, but if the lights are only 27 watts, then you'll probably have nothing to worry about. A standard 55 watt set of lights will take half a volt right off the top of the V12's barely adequate charging system while running down the highway. And that's without the high beam on.

I typically use the accessory leads as the "ignition on" trigger for my relays. The only exception would be a 12volt plug somewhere on the bike wired directly to the battery (fused of course) for air compressor or emergency situation where you don't want to have the bike's ignition on for 10 minutes. Also, that you wouldn't likely leave something plugged into it and turned on only to run the battery down.

If you run a fuse holder between the battery and aux fuse block, then it will need to be rated for whatever the total number of amps for the accessories you'll be adding. Otherwise, you may not be able to run all the added accessories without either blowing the fuse, or overloading the fuse holder itself. Since the fuse block is only rated to 30 amps, then your 30 amp fuse holder should suffice as long as your planned additions won't total more draw than that.

Chris, I have a few questions. The main power supply you show, has no fuse. Do I not need a fuse there? I bought the power supply line because the box said it was rated at 30A. I like your idea of overbuilding, I think the power supply I have is 12ga. wire. Judging by what the box said, it is probably just barely capable of 30A. I probably won't have more than 20A draw on the whole thing anyway so I guess it will do.
I like the idea of a separate switch to be able to turn them off when necessary. My only concern is my ability to wire such a system. I'm already at a loss just including the relay!
"I typically use the accessory leads as the "ignition on" trigger for my relays." This sounds like a good idea but also baffles me. IIRC, there is one lead from the relay that would go to the switch for the accessory (or light) I'm tying to. Is this what you mean? I remember seeing a basic relay wiring diagram on here somewhere, I'll have to find it again.
I also think your idea of a "hot" accessory port, with the ignition off is a great idea. Would this just be fused and wired directly from the block or would a relay be involved somehow? How would you limit the amperage going to this outlet? I'm sure a compressor draws some amps, especially at startup. Did you use a regular "cigar lighter" outlet?
I know, lots of questions. I do appreciate the assistance. As you can see when it comes to electricity... . I'd rather be holding a wrench than a meter!

[Chris near Kansas City]

Chris, I have a few questions. The main power supply you show, has no fuse. Do I not need a fuse there?

I don't feel it's needed. Doesn't hurt to have one, other than making sure it's rated for the total draw of add-ons or fuse block rating. Everything plugged into the fuse block, is, well.....fused. If you were mounting the block far away from the battery, like on the rear fender, LOL, then yes a fuse would be a good idea. The length of that type of run, would be more susceptible to getting damaged. So, having it fused would be a good idea. But that short of a run from the battery to the top of the ignitor, I don't see the need. Plus, the factory wire from the battery to the original fuse block (large white wire with red tracer), isn't fused. But there is nothing wrong with redundancy and if you already have the fuse holder, then you could go ahead and use it if you wanted to.

"I typically use the accessory leads as the "ignition on" trigger for my relays." This sounds like a good idea but also baffles me. IIRC, there is one lead from the relay that would go to the switch for the accessory (or light) I'm tying to. Is this what you mean?

Exactly. I'll go into more detail on that when I'm not late for work, LOL.

I also think your idea of a "hot" accessory port, with the ignition off is a great idea. Would this just be fused and wired directly from the block or would a relay be involved somehow? How would you limit the amperage going to this outlet? I'm sure a compressor draws some amps, especially at startup. Did you use a regular "cigar lighter" outlet?

Either wired from the fuse block or hardwired from the battery. But the reason for adding the aux fuse block is un-cluttering the wiring at the battery, right? A 10 amp fuse would be fine and enough to cover a simple $10 Wallyworld compressor. I used a waterproof unit from Wallyworld or auto parts store. I'll post a pic at lunch or tonight when I get home. On one of my bikes, I just took an old connector from one of the Battery Tenders and attached it to the 12v socket. That way, when the bike is being ridden, I just hook it to the Battery Tender wiring coming off the battery. The 12v socket was ziptied to the top of the front brake master cylinder. Crude, but was effective for the moment.

Gotta go scrape ice off the car. I'll post some more info later on.

Chris

[Muleears]

Under no circumstances should you waste your lunch hour answering my silly questions!
I am teleworking today and cheating by having two computers on the same desk. While waiting for the work laptop I can post here... Kind of multi-tasking

This should make you laugh, after reading your comment about the old Battery Tender I remembered I had just thrown one away yesterday. I just finished fishing it out of the trash and cutting the power cord off for use later! That was a good idea!

[Muleears]

Found this elsewhere on the web.


Looks like the wiring setup I need. Couple questions though, I'm not sure where the "Hi, lo, ign" wire comes from. I'm assuming it is either the ignition switch or the headlight switch (hi, lo beam), but how do I connect to it? Everything else I think I can figure out. I guess the relay needs to be rated at sufficient amperage to cover the load?

[Chris near Kansas City]

This is the one that I had tied to the top of the brake master on one of the bikes. Upside down of course.



Another bike I made a bracket to hang 2 or 3 things off of and one of these was on the bottom. There are lots of choices out there. I know of one guy that found some waterproof/water resistant sockets with rubber style caps. He mounted 2 of them in the cruise box. You could mount one in either of the black fairing cowlings, inside either of the fairing pockets or pocket lids, or even in the trunk (there are accessory leads under the trunk). Choice is up to you and how you want to use it.

In the diagram you posted, the wiring for the switch is for a lighted switch. If you didn't have/want/need a lighted switch, you could eliminate the ground wire completely. The "hi/low/ign" would be a switched source, like from the accessory leads or ignition switch itself.

[Muleears]

This is the one that I had tied to the top of the brake master on one of the bikes. Upside down of course.


Another bike I made a bracket to hang 2 or 3 things off of and one of these was on the bottom. There are lots of choices out there. I know of one guy that found some waterproof/water resistant sockets with rubber style caps. He mounted 2 of them in the cruise box. You could mount one in either of the black fairing cowlings, inside either of the fairing pockets or pocket lids, or even in the trunk (there are accessory leads under the trunk). Choice is up to you and how you want to use it.

In the diagram you posted, the wiring for the switch is for a lighted switch. If you didn't have/want/need a lighted switch, you could eliminate the ground wire completely. The "hi/low/ign" would be a switched source, like from the accessory leads or ignition switch itself.

Thanks again Chris. I have several 12V cigar lighter multipliers that I have collected for various cars. I think I will wire one of them directly (fused) to my new block and hide it in the locked fairing pocket. That would give me three 12V outlets that I could keep out of the way. One of them even has a 5v USB port.
Regarding the relay wiring, I don't need a lighted switch, so I can eliminate the ground wire from the switch. How do I find the correct "switched" wire from the ignition? Use my test light and prod till I find one that comes on with the ignition? Then use one of those splice doo-dads that you clamp with a pair of pliers? I can post some pics of this stuff if you like, I just don't have them handy right now. Thanks in advance

[Chris near Kansas City]

How do I find the correct "switched" wire from the ignition? Use my test light and prod till I find one that comes on with the ignition? Then use one of those splice doo-dads that you clamp with a pair of pliers?

You could use the accessory lead behind the headlight for your feed. It is already a 30amp fused circuit if I recall. Just need a male bullet connector and plug it in. Or, yes, you could tap into the ignition wiring, but I'd recommend doing that on the other side of the ignition switch connector (bike harness side). I'll check the wiring diagram for wire color.

Those blue Scotchloc connectors, or wire taps, otherwise known as trailer connectors are the devil's spawn, in my humble opinion. Read into that what you will. I'd rather see wires twisted together and covered in a ball of electrical tape than those things.

[Chris near Kansas City]

Yes, with a test light you can find the wires that would be hot with the ignition on. The trigger side of a relay draws such low amperage that you should be able to tie into just about any wire that is hot when on. I've just seen so many botched attempts at soldering or crimping or cutting and splicing, that cause problems farther down the line.

[Muleears]

Yes, with a test light you can find the wires that would be hot with the ignition on. The trigger side of a relay draws such low amperage that you should be able to tie into just about any wire that is hot when on. I've just seen so many botched attempts at soldering or crimping or cutting and splicing, that cause problems farther down the line.

Thanks again Chris! I'll be sure to stay away from the wire taps
I remember reading that you can access the accessory tap up front by removing the headlight and part of the fairing? This is not the wire I would use to power my lights, this is just to send the signal to the relay to turn the lights on, correct? After going through the switch?

[Chris near Kansas City]

Yes and yes. The accessory leads are powered on by the ignition switch. Use them to run to your light switch. From the switch you would run it to trigger the relay (terminal 86).

I use the accessory leads under the trunk to directly power a 12v socket in the trunk. I use it to charge the cell phone or backup cell phone.