This is just a rant.
I'm leaving tomorrow for a short trip to SoCal; but my cruise control still won't work. I have a problem with the CC "cancel" circuit -- it's closed when it should be open. At first, I thought it was the throttle switch, apparently mostly just because I want to disable that anyway. But testing a little more carefully and objectively, it's really the clutch switch. So I unplugged the switch, and the CC problem went away (the Cancel test went open). But now the bike won't start.
The WizzBang App, which is basically just a schematic for me because Dave still won't tell me how to make it go, doesn't show a "clutch switch". That isn't in the manual either. So like any reasonable kindergartner, I just looked at the pictures. And there it is, but called the "starter lockout switch". Except it's also a CC cancel switch -- it has 3 wires.
Now, the brakes have a similar problem, needing to both turn on the brake lights (normally open) and turn off the CC (normally closed). But for them, MaKa sensibly used two separate 2-wire switches. That I can understand. However, for the clutch, we get a compound 3-wire switch that for some reason just couldn't be called the "clutch switch".
So, which part is for CC cancel, and which for the starter? Well, the WizzBang App goes right into a diode, which is another unnecessary complexity to get around using a gated switch in the CC: it basically allows charging a subcircuit with an instantaneous jolt of power, which charges a relay to activate the CC, which also loops current (the opposite direction -- small wonder LEDs don't work in the CC indicators) to keep that relay charged after you take your finger off the Set button, thus keeping the CC on until you interrupt that loop with one of the cancel switches. When MaKa could've instead activated a gated relay (to activate the CC) that would stay closed until you hit one of those cancel switches, which would've then opened (and stayed open) until you Set/Resumed the CC again.
And so the clutch switch has one part that cancels the CC (normally open) and another part that supplies 12V to that unnecessarily weird CC subcircuit.
After sorta wrapping my head around all of that, and taking my medication (comes in an aluminum can) -- mind you, I went through all of this just a couple years ago -- I take the offending switch apart. It works just fine, which it should because I replaced the damn thing just a couple years ago.
So today, I have to find out whether the clutch lever really operates it right (probably), and then look for some other reason why one wire (I still can't figure out which one) is shorting and cancelling the CC.
So I can use the friggin' CC ... tomorrow.
clutch switch
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clutch switch
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Re: clutch switch
... I know a great big light bulb will come on any second!!! Best to Ya!!!!
On a trip last year to Deadwood, lost my front hub speedo mechanism
and had to use my backup throttle rocker for 4 daze.... real pain....
literally!
On a trip last year to Deadwood, lost my front hub speedo mechanism
and had to use my backup throttle rocker for 4 daze.... real pain....
literally!
'03 Voyager - http://tinyurl.com/mqtgpwp VROC pics of Gina
Cranky - Bill Snodgrass AVA # 6544. VROC # 16804
Cranked >128K miles, Mtn bike-no motor!!!
San Jose, KalEfornYa
Cranky - Bill Snodgrass AVA # 6544. VROC # 16804
Cranked >128K miles, Mtn bike-no motor!!!
San Jose, KalEfornYa
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Re: clutch switch
Don't know if this helps but I took these awhile ago. Note that 2 of the colours indicated on the switch body are sub harness colours and change colours at the main harness plastic connector. The Black noted on the switch body becomes Yellow/Green and the Black/Red becomes Light Green. I did check several sub harnesses to ensure my colour labelling of the switch terminals was correct and they are correct.
I just performed a continuity test to check my findings from 2015 and perhaps it's me or perhaps its my meter but I do not get the same results as published in the MSM on page 15-39 and shown in the 2nd photo. Perhaps it is due to the fact that the switch I checked was on a bench test situation and NOT connected to the harness but I' don't think so.
My test results were with the plunger pushed in to the switch body to simulate the lever being released, clutch engaged and then with the plunger extended free from the switch body which would duplicate the lever being pulled in against the grip, clutch dis-engaged.
With the plunger in, simulating the lever released I recorded a closed circuit between the Bk/R and the Bk terminals and an open circuit between the Bk/Y and the Bk terminals. This IS as shown in the MSM.
Next i positioned the plunger extended free from the switch body simulating the lever pulled in and recorded an open circuit between the Bk/R and the Bk terminals and a closed circuit between the Bk/Y and the Bk terminals: NOT as shown in the table from the MSM for the lever in connections!
As well, I recorded open circuits between the Bk/R and Bk/y regardless of the plunger position; in or out.
So there Nails this should further confuse anyone reading these 2 posts.
I hope this may help but I'm not sure if I'm misunderstanding something here or if there actually is a misprint in the MSM.
Dave
I just performed a continuity test to check my findings from 2015 and perhaps it's me or perhaps its my meter but I do not get the same results as published in the MSM on page 15-39 and shown in the 2nd photo. Perhaps it is due to the fact that the switch I checked was on a bench test situation and NOT connected to the harness but I' don't think so.
My test results were with the plunger pushed in to the switch body to simulate the lever being released, clutch engaged and then with the plunger extended free from the switch body which would duplicate the lever being pulled in against the grip, clutch dis-engaged.
With the plunger in, simulating the lever released I recorded a closed circuit between the Bk/R and the Bk terminals and an open circuit between the Bk/Y and the Bk terminals. This IS as shown in the MSM.
Next i positioned the plunger extended free from the switch body simulating the lever pulled in and recorded an open circuit between the Bk/R and the Bk terminals and a closed circuit between the Bk/Y and the Bk terminals: NOT as shown in the table from the MSM for the lever in connections!
As well, I recorded open circuits between the Bk/R and Bk/y regardless of the plunger position; in or out.
So there Nails this should further confuse anyone reading these 2 posts.
I hope this may help but I'm not sure if I'm misunderstanding something here or if there actually is a misprint in the MSM.
Dave
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Re: clutch switch
Dave, Thanks. I got the same bench result you did, but I was probably confused for longer than you by the switch being "in" when the lever is "out". (Another of the Opposite Day things that are causing my Budweizers, or whatever it's called, to act up.) I still don't really know which wire is CC and which starter lockout, but don't care anymore. I don't think there's really any problem with my clutch switch after all. And I agree that the manual drawing doesn't make sense with the physical guts of the switch you exposed. (The old clutch switch was falling apart, and replacing it fixed the CC.)
Now, when I hook it up and measure continuity on pin 16 of the CC module, it's normally closed to ground as it's supposed to be. Pulling the brake lever opens it. So I'm done with the cancel switch checks. I've focused on that because the CC died gradually. It still occasionally Sets, but only for a few seconds.
I don't think I really changed anything since my last road test, but I'll take it out again in a few minutes. I'm tired of chasing my tail, so I'm going confirmation-heavy. For this road test, and to get Karma back on my side, I did NOT put the fairing all the way back together. I reckon there's a good chance that'll fix it right there. Plus, I had left-over pizza for breakfast -- always brings me good luck.
The only thing left seems to be the Set switch, which wouldn't really make sense to me. Either that or an intermittent problem.
Now, when I hook it up and measure continuity on pin 16 of the CC module, it's normally closed to ground as it's supposed to be. Pulling the brake lever opens it. So I'm done with the cancel switch checks. I've focused on that because the CC died gradually. It still occasionally Sets, but only for a few seconds.
I don't think I really changed anything since my last road test, but I'll take it out again in a few minutes. I'm tired of chasing my tail, so I'm going confirmation-heavy. For this road test, and to get Karma back on my side, I did NOT put the fairing all the way back together. I reckon there's a good chance that'll fix it right there. Plus, I had left-over pizza for breakfast -- always brings me good luck.
The only thing left seems to be the Set switch, which wouldn't really make sense to me. Either that or an intermittent problem.
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Re: clutch switch
just a long shot but try jumping the Bk/Y and the BK/R wires at the side stand switch together when you do a road test, just as a temporary measure
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Re: clutch switch
Still not working -- gonna be another VistaCruise trip.
We had a hail-uva storm this afternoon -- I saw some 1.5" pups.
I'll put the sidestand wires back and pick this little effort back up when I return.
The bike is mostly packed and ready to ride. That'll be nice.
We had a hail-uva storm this afternoon -- I saw some 1.5" pups.
I'll put the sidestand wires back and pick this little effort back up when I return.
The bike is mostly packed and ready to ride. That'll be nice.
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Nails
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