Anybody tried this ammeter/voltmeter combo?

[Muleears]

http://www.amazon.com/BeesClover-Digita ... =pd_cp_e_0

Since I'm going to be fiddling with my electrical system, adding lights, horns etc. Someone suggested an ammeter may be a good idea. I kind of like the idea of having both volt and ammeters. I have a couple questions though, what range ammeter do I need? I know my alternator is 35 amps, do I need one that will cover 35 amps or one that has a smaller range, such as 0-10A ? Doesn't an ammeter measure the difference between alternator output and load? I have noticed that some of these ammeters require a shunt, others measuring less than 10A don't. Is that due to design of the ammeter or does one simply require a shunt if measuring over 10A?

I'm also not sure if i like the digital, analog may "fit" better.

I've already replaced the turns and stops with LED's to save amperage, but I plan on adding 54 watts of lights (4.5A, correct?) and a LOUD horn(s) (I've no idea what a horn draws) and maybe eventually a higher wattage headlight. I haven't decided on the headlight, whether wattage or HID or LED. Have to consider the wallet equation.

Any and all input is greatly appreciated

[SgtSlag]

The Ammeter requires a shunt due to the >10 Amps of current. I would not recommend an Ammeter because when you hit the Starter, it can draw a lot of amps to turn over your engine (50+ Amps -- needs a heavy shunt to handle this much current without getting hot/blocking flow of juice due to resistance). Amps are like volume of water in a pipe: the greater the amps, the bigger the copper wire needed to carry the volume of electricity; if you use too small a wire, it will get hot, and it could even start a fire (fuses/circuit breakers open up before excess current can cause a fire -- if you put them in the circuit, if not, then be prepared for fire...).

For your stated purposes, of monitoring the health of your charging system (avoiding drawing too much current, and killing the battery, which will leave you stranded...), I would suggest just a Voltmeter. There are many options to choose from, but when your current/amperage exceeds the output of your alternator/charging system, the battery will supply what it can, and the voltage on the battery will drop below 13 Volts, indicating you are draining your battery, not charging it -- this is when the engine is above 2,000 RPM, when it should be charging the battery.

There are automotive Voltmeters which can be used on a bike. That is what I used on my Honda. For my Voyager, I splurged, and I installed an Argus Battery Bug: it has an LCD display, no backlighting (low current drain, would take weeks/months before it drained the battery dead, by itself); it monitors the battery's voltage on start-up's, indicating how much 'life' the battery has left in it, before I need to replace it (gives a %-reading, also has audible alerts); I believe it will give an audible alert when the system voltage drops too low.

Another option, is to get one which plugs into a cigarette lighter plug, these run around $8-$12, have a lighted display, and are available everywhere. The best connection point for any Voltmeter, is across the battery terminals, as this is what you are most interested in, and by taking a reading at the battery, you avoid voltage drops which could give you false readings.

Then there is this unit, Clearwater Voltage Sentry. It is spendy, like the Argus, but it has an easy-to-understand LED indicator (but it does not monitor the life of the battery, when starting). You have many options, but by using strictly a Voltmeter, you avoid the issues with a shunt, and you still get what you need, in a much safer, easier manner. Cheers!

[Muleears]

Thanks SGT. For the detailed and informative explanation. I see your point about the amps drawn at startup. I knew it was a lot but not that many I would be perfectly happy with just a voltmeter. I think I could interpret what it is telling me. I saw those voltmeters that you plug into the cigar lighter on ebay for less than $3. Would you recommend a digital or analog voltmeter? As you can tell, when it comes to electricity I am easily baffled.....
Thanks again for the advice.

[Lucasind]

.....I too am insalling a voltmeter this winter on my 03 voy 12 ... another plus for doing this is, when out touring,you may be many miles from anywhere, Constantly monitering what your charging system is doing, gives you the ability to break off course and start heading somewhere that may be to your advantage , rather than along side of the road when you no longer have enough voltage for the ignition system or electric fuel pump to continue functioning. If JIM M. is out there , I think he could chime in on a experience that he had along these lines. just my 0.02........................................tony

[Muleears]

You all have convinced me, a voltmeter it is. I think a digital one will give me a little better picture of the true status. I'm afraid I couldn't see a one or two volt difference on an analog gauge. These old eyes aren't what they used to be.....

Don't I want it reading directly from the battery to get the truest reading? If so, how do I do that and still have it switched (so it's not on all the time)? Or will reading from any switched wire and the battery neg. be accurate enough?

[ekap1200]

here is one from ( digitalmeter.com ) I think it was about 50 dollars back when I purchased it.
Powered off of the acc lead behind headlamp. No draw unless the key is on...Its made to hold up on bikes and is waterproof, epoxy sealed unit. Has been a great investment for me.

[Tom(North Alabama)]

Just got this one this winter, has clock and temperature. Have not put it to the long distance test yet, but it seems to work well.

Not waterproof, but that is a good reason to carry a zip-lock sandwich bag it is water resistant, if it works good at this price, it's cheap to replace. And real easy to install, I removed the cig plug and wired to the aux plug behind the headlight.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gigital-LCD-Car ... 2335e04965

[kehnisz]

Here is where I installed Clock/Volt/Temperature.

I also provided a little shelter for the device to keep the water off.

http://www.ehnisz.com/VoyagerXII.htm

[Chris near Kansas City]

I loved that meter. But after having to replace 2 of them, I went with the one that ekap1200 has. I installed it in the tachometer with the rest of the gauges.

[Muleears]

Thanks guys, those are all great suggestions. I had been looking at the one Ekap1200 has as I can get them on ebay for about $8.00 (waterproof and epoxy coated), but you have to wait for them to get here from China Or you can buy from a US seller for about $12.00 and get them quicker (I'm sure it's the same unit though).

But for the same $12.00 I can have one like Tom has. Mount it with velcro and quick dis-connect plugs and throw it in the saddlebag if there's a threat of rain. Even if it goes belly up the expense isn't gonna break the bank and the extra info would be nice.

Chris has a great idea in mounting the voltmeter inside the tach housing. That would look great and be protected too. Decisions, decisions..... You guys didn't make this much easier!

I suppose I could also mount the voltmeter like Chris did and just get one of those stick on thermometers and put it anywhere. Oh well, I still have some time before riding season. BUT it is supposed to be 60* here on Tuesday! That's warm enough for a ride!

Thanks again gentlemen, as always you have been very helpful. I have gotten so much from this organization that I have officially joined. I should get my membership packet in 7-10 days!

[ekap1200]

Ebay does have quite a selection of meters, BUT, keep in mind that if it is a PANEL meter it will most likely not hold up on a bike. Unless it is a sealed water-proof unit and panel mount style, open circuit boards don't do well in the weather. I did see some very nice small ones that would nice to be mounted where Chris has his. Of which Chris done a great job of pulling off, but not for the average DIY-er. Allot could go wrong on that modification but Chris has the experience to pull it off. Personally I would not use an ammeter , if your alt is not putting out your voltage will show it. And the newer batteries that are on the market that no longer require a hydrometer to check the specific gravity , they state a voltage correlating to the charge of the battery. If with all your accessories on your voltage goes below 12.8 , your drawing too much. Biggest killer I see is driving lamps, and with the newer generation of led arrays in them , they are the way to go. Good luck on making your decision and modification. Gene Kap.

[Muleears]

Ebay does have quite a selection of meters, BUT, keep in mind that if it is a PANEL meter it will most likely not hold up on a bike. Unless it is a sealed water-proof unit and panel mount style, open circuit boards don't do well in the weather. I did see some very nice small ones that would nice to be mounted where Chris has his. Of which Chris done a great job of pulling off, but not for the average DIY-er. Allot could go wrong on that modification but Chris has the experience to pull it off. Personally I would not use an ammeter , if your alt is not putting out your voltage will show it. And the newer batteries that are on the market that no longer require a hydrometer to check the specific gravity , they state a voltage correlating to the charge of the battery. If with all your accessories on your voltage goes below 12.8 , your drawing too much. Biggest killer I see is driving lamps, and with the newer generation of led arrays in them , they are the way to go. Good luck on making your decision and modification. Gene Kap.

Thanks Gene, those are some good points. I know I had seen at least one that stated it was epoxy coated, water, dust, shock, etc. proof. That would be the one I need, but I don't think I'll go that way now anyway. I may just wire in one of the automotive units like Tom used and replace it if/when it goes belly up. I like the idea of having the temp also. I'm so fickle.... I'll probably end up not doing anything!

[Chris near Kansas City]

I liked the clock and temp feature. But with Pete's radio mod, I now have the clock all the time, and not having the thermometer only means that I know it's hot outside. Just not how hot, lol. Sometimes you are better off not knowing, lol.

[Chris near Kansas City]

Of which Chris done a great job of pulling off, but not for the average DIY-er. Allot could go wrong on that modification but Chris has the experience to pull it off.

3 hours to put it in, and that was after getting the cluster off the bike.

http://www.amervoyassoc.org/forum/viewt ... f=3&t=2814

[SgtSlag]

The two easiest, quickest options would be the plug-in model, for the accessory outlet. Downside is that you have to unplug it every time you park the bike. Still, it is very inexpensive, and easy.

The Argus Battery Bug is simple enough to use as well: pull the bolts on the battery, connect the ring connectors to the battery's bolts, run the long wires up the chassis, and mount it with the peel-n-stick velcro tabs included with the device. This unit does not need to be switched, and it is always on (can't be seen at night, however).

If you take a reading anywhere other than the battery's terminals, you will get a slightly lower reading, due to voltage drops. It will be a small drop, so the best thing is to keep an eye on it, and learn what is 'normal', and only be concerned when it gets even lower. Cheers!

[Muleears]

The two easiest, quickest options would be the plug-in model, for the accessory outlet. Downside is that you have to unplug it every time you park the bike. Still, it is very inexpensive, and easy.

The Argus Battery Bug is simple enough to use as well: pull the bolts on the battery, connect the ring connectors to the battery's bolts, run the long wires up the chassis, and mount it with the peel-n-stick velcro tabs included with the device. This unit does not need to be switched, and it is always on (can't be seen at night, however).

If you take a reading anywhere other than the battery's terminals, you will get a slightly lower reading, due to voltage drops. It will be a small drop, so the best thing is to keep an eye on it, and learn what is 'normal', and only be concerned when it gets even lower. Cheers!

Thanks SGT. Great advice as always!

[suzib6sw]

I use the Argus Battery bug.. Its very easy to use, resetable. and gives cranking condition ..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ayya5kOMmyY

it may be they are out of business but the bugs are still out there.. Make sure you get the right one for a motorcycle.

Apparently Midtronics filed a patent infringement against Argus..


Cheers..
Pete

[Muleears]

Amazon still has them available, but temporarily out of stock:

http://www.amazon.com/Argus-BB-SBM12-PS ... attery+bug

Don't know how long they will be out of stock.....

[Lucasind]

....Thanks PETE for the post on ARGUS....as M.E. stated..(out of stock) thinking "patent infringement" = LAWSUIT..... I don't think I'll wait around for one of these! I watched the entire 5 minute video, and agree that it's the CAT'S ASS I still have my bike apart ,adding L.E.D.'s and winter maintenance. I like the one GENE KAP posted.. and I think I will hold off a minute on ordering one... afterall, we are getting another 5 inches of snow here in toledo tonight
on another note... quick question... my wife said she had no use for the rear stereo controler, and said it was just in the way, so at the last ride before winter really set in ,, I removed it. instead of spending time looking in to this , Tell me how to regain the rear speakers sound , the front to rear fader control on the left side of the fairing is ineffective to regaining sound.to the rear speakers, front works fine. , thank you............tony

[ekap1200]

Hello Tony, Sounds like a FIAT moment ! When you pulled the rear unit did you forget to connect the rear speaker plugs back together after removing the cover bag. Sounds like a dumb question but I had to ask...
Another note ; since you have this bike down to what I see in the picture, it would be the time to modify your turn signal cancel time, to increase its time before canceling. I posted the units make and model number and source of supply here on the forum.. Gene Kap