Why is the Kawasaki manual as clear as mud?

[ghostler]

I finally got the manual. The drawings show the oil filter spring and washer going under the unit. The removal instructions state to remove the spring and washer, then the filter off the basket.

Which is correct?

I went by the exploded diagram. It shows the spring and washer underneath the filter. I guess it is over. I drove the bike 800 miles. Now it has a knock on the right side, pronounced above and around 2k rpm. Engine idles rough and misses at 1500 rpm.

Last 30 miles when I noticed, I nursed it by keeping below 2000 rpm and gently shifting.

Is the engine now toast?

[debron]

I finally got the manual. The drawings show the oil filter spring and washer going under the unit. The removal instructions state to remove the spring and washer, then the filter off the basket.

Which is correct?

The drawing is correct, the spring and washer go under so as to push the filter up to seat it. The instructions are also correct but you got them in the wrong order. The manual (at least my copy) says to remove the filter, then the spring and washer, which really is the only way to do it, assuming the last person to change the filter reinstalled it correctly.

Whether your engine is toast or not remains to be seen. First question, did you drain all of the oil from both drain plugs? Next, did you put in 3qts, 22oz of oil, no more?

My engine had a knock when I bought it but when I drained the oil, it had well over 4qts in it. I put in new oil, 3qts, 22oz, and filter and the knock went away. The engine has run great for more than 45,000 miles since (except when it had a broken spark plug cap!)

[Mr Jensee]

I am NOT an engine expert, however I have owned a ZRX1100 with the same filter and a Voyager. I have at least once on the ZRX put the spring and washer in wrong without deleterious effects. You only have 800 miles on the bike since the oil change, not likely that caused the knock. Make sure you put the correct amount of oil in the bike. This is critical. Over filling could be responsible for the knock.

[voyager55]

Look at page two

https://onedrive.live.com/view.aspx?cid ... pp=WordPdf

It shows the filter & assy

Be sure to fill using 3 quarts 22 oz. If you overfill knocking can occur

[debron]

Look at page two

https://onedrive.live.com/view.aspx?cid ... pp=WordPdf

It shows the filter & assy

Be sure to fill using 3 quarts 22 oz. If you overfill knocking can occur

. . . and page 6 gives the instructions.

[ghostler]

Thanks all for your replies. This time, I put the washer under the filter next to the filter rubber grommet and the spring under it to push it up. Previous owner had it above the filter. I deduced that by doing it this way, it was bypassing the filter. I followed his way in a previous oil change.

I removed both oil drain plugs, I put 3 quarts and 22 ounces. I had W10-40 standard auto oil and used that this time. There is a definite metallic knock on the right side of the engine. It is similar to an engine bearing knock. it is a rattle that occurs at a little over 2k rpm.

Is there a way to check things without pulling the engine? What could cause this sound?

[triton28]

Perhaps the crankshaft balancers need attending to.

[JHD]

Is your noise a knock or a rattle. Now I just fixed my motor which had a rattling noise. This rattle was caused by a broken starter chain tensioner. Hard alternator rubbers can cause a rattle. Carl Leo also mentioned to me that carbs that are way out of sync can cause a rattle. These all are unique types of rattle. I would suggest getting a automotive stethoscope. Very inexpensive and works better to diagnose noises than the plastic end of a screw driver. You could video and post. Hopefully you are wrong about the bearing being the issue.

Brad

[ghostler]

Is your noise a knock or a rattle. Now I just fixed my motor which had a rattling noise. This rattle was caused by a broken starter chain tensioner. Hard alternator rubbers can cause a rattle. Carl Leo also mentioned to me that carbs that are way out of sync can cause a rattle. These all are unique types of rattle. I would suggest getting a automotive stethoscope. Very inexpensive and works better to diagnose noises than the plastic end of a screw driver. You could video and post. Hopefully you are wrong about the bearing being the issue. Brad

I hope I am wrong. It is a definite knock, most prominent around 2,000 rpm, but there is a very slight and hard to discern rattle. It is definitely on the right (throttle hand) side down low around the crankshaft. I'm thinking that the possibility of a starter chain tensioner or something of that sort may be the culprit. Since I am out of the way visiting family in Kansas City, MO, does anyone know of a decent and honest wrench in these parts that would be worth having them fix it?

[chevyman1]

I think I read somewhere on the form that the clutch can make a noise like that

[ghostler]

Today while at my son's house 800 miles from home, I drained the oil. Upon opening the cock, the hot oil poured out like water, hitting the pan and splashing out, which surprised me. Otherwise, oil looked slightly used but not bad, which I'd expect of low mileage oil.

About 3-1/2 quarts of was recovered into an old gallon jug (3.4 quarts per manual for oil filter not replaced), so it couldn't have been diluted by say fuel seeping past a botched carb needle.

I put 3 quarts 15W-40 diesel motor oil and 13 ounces of Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer (basically 10% of total oil volume per recommendations for wet clutch). Now, it runs much quieter.

Come to think of it the opened jug I had was probably at least 10 years old. I bought it for my previous motorcycle. I didn't think oil might possibly break down over age. With the added punishment of heat running in the heat of summer, although water temperature did not climb significantly, apparently the oil broke down.

At the time of loud knocking, I had just exited the freeway after riding at 75 MPH for about an hour. The bike with this thinner oil wasn't getting the cushioning it should. It sounded noisy even at idle and low RPM's.

The bike no longer sounds like engine is well worn out.

[vxiirider]

The manual says ---3.4 Liters ( 3 qt , 22 oz) with filter change and 3.2 liters ( 3 qt, 12 oz)without filter change.

So the amount of oil you filled, without the filter change is correct.

[ghostler]

The manual says ---3.4 Liters ( 3 qt , 22 oz) with filter change and 3.2 liters ( 3 qt, 12 oz)without filter change. So the amount of oil you filled, without the filter change is correct.

I arrived home last night after travelling 1,821 miles R/T to Kansas City, MO back to Clovis, NM. Oil change to 15W-40 Diesel dino with 13 oz. Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer quieted my 2001. Slight knock is still there occasionally on cold start up and running, disappears about 2,000 rpm, certainly seems to be a main bearing. Will have to check the manual for clearances used. I'm wondering if clearances are looser than on a standard automotive engine, to allow for greater oil flow around bearing areas.

Also, I used Seafoam gas treatment on the return trip. Was surprised how well this stuff works. I was thinking I'd have to rebuild the carburetors. After 500 miles of riding on the return leg, idle was smoothed out. I'm glad I used a name brand product and not some off-brand parts store branded additive. I thought there was no such thing as magic with additives.

I've ridden in the New Mexico and Panhandle Texas winds for the past decade, but through parts of Oklahoma south of Oklahoma City to Vernon Texas on to Muleshoe, encountered the worst winds ever, even had to slow to 60 MPH in parts. Overcast was nice though through the overly warm weather.

[lockwoodjohn]

Ghostler,
Glad to hear your engine is OK, And you made it home OK!!
lockwoodjohn

[ghostler]

Ghostler, Glad to hear your engine is OK, And you made it home OK!! lockwoodjohn

Thanks! I'm still learning more and more about this bike. Engine seems similar to a 4 banger auto engine especially with low red line of 7.5k, but is hotter with the twin cams and a carb per cylinder. My 1967 Datsun PL-411 "Bluebird" sedan had a 1300, but only put out like 60 some horses versus the Voyager at almost 100. Noise is more readily apparent even with water jackets.

On portions of the ride where road was reasonably level, I was getting a touch over 50 mpg at speeds to 70 mph. On hilly terrain, it dropped to 40's.

Also learned one thing. In New Mexico, we have low relative humidity. In NM with the very dry weather, my Joe Rocket textile Meteor Jacket and overpants keeps me cool with its venting system, my sweat evaporates cooling me and guards against dehydration. Mesh gear doesn't work as well in ultra dry temps above 95. However, gear came in handy where last hour was in rain through Kansas City, MO, kept me dry.

WIth temps in the mid to high '90s and high humidity, my gear was hot to ride in, even with vent pockets opened. I dropped the jacket and wore a thin wind breaker. Next time I'll bring my mesh gear.

[Mr Jensee]

The temps here in Louisiana right now are in the mid nineties with humidity often above 80%. Unless I am out on the open roads which I will do tomorrow with some friends, riding is nearly unbearable. I usually ride with a mesh jacket and might tomorrow but it is hard to stay comfortable when the heat is this oppressive. The Voyager XII seems to revel in the heat though, and mine has performed flawlessly. I was indeed so fortunate to find a bike that someone took such great care of before I got it. Last month a friend of mine and I rode up to north east Texas, about 450 miles one way and back and enjoyed the trip but the seat became nearly unbearable by the end of the day. That was my only issue with my Voyager. It amazes me how you guys ride so far without having to soak your tushes in a tub at the end of the day!

[ghostler]

The temps here in Louisiana right now are in the mid nineties with humidity often above 80%. Unless I am out on the open roads which I will do tomorrow with some friends, riding is nearly unbearable. I usually ride with a mesh jacket and might tomorrow but it is hard to stay comfortable when the heat is this oppressive. The Voyager XII seems to revel in the heat though, and mine has performed flawlessly. I was indeed so fortunate to find a bike that someone took such great care of before I got it. Last month a friend of mine and I rode up to north east Texas, about 450 miles one way and back and enjoyed the trip but the seat became nearly unbearable by the end of the day. That was my only issue with my Voyager. It amazes me how you guys ride so far without having to soak your tushes in a tub at the end of the day!

For me, the seat isn't the most comfortable but it certainly isn't the worse either. Prior to my Voyager 1200, I rode a 1987 Suzuki Savage all around New Mexico, parts of Arizona and Texas, even crossed the border into Colorado. Replacing the 1-hour OEM seat with a gel seat helped, but it wasn't perfect. (It was funny, people I knew would see me meet up with them, ask me how I could ride such a small thing, and call me a real biker for going the distance. I'd tell them that a 650 in the 1960's and 1970's was considered a big bike, and people toured with what we now call "small bikes".) Compared with what I rode before, the Voyager with its warts is considerably more comfortable.

One thing that helped me was to lose 50 lbs, per doc's orders. At age 60 I'm close to my right weight but have a little more to go. Also, aerobics several times a week, ride a 10-speed bike 8 miles or if inclimate weather 30 minutes on the elliptical exerciser, also have a small workout with weights. Have to stay healthy, not getting any younger.

I consider this bike a training background for maintaining. Might invest in something new down the road, which I really like. We'll see how my 2001 performs when I hook up the new HF trailer with a partial load I recently put together and how she responds. Any true problems will most likely surface then.

[ghostler]

That knocking sound after oil change to 20W-50 Diesel motor oil and adding Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer while in Kansas City, MO hasn't returned. Last week, I traveled to Black River Village, NM (about 12 miles south of Carlsbad, NM, a round trip mileage of about 436 miles pulling my fully loaded HF #90153 trailer with Sears XCargo box.

I've replaced bearings during overhauls on an auto engine that fixed knocking problems. If a bad engine bearing, would have evidenced itself being loaded down pulling the trailer. The engine ran smoothly, I'm stumped.

Then I guess the XII's engine is inherently more noisy than a Goldwing engine. Lately I've been referring to my XII as a poor man's Goldwing.

I've got an odd squeaking noise only when in motion that appears to possibly be from the fairing. Location isn't obvious, what places might be the culprit?

[Lumpy Rider]

Hi Ghostler. I have owned my 2001 V12 a couple months now. It is a low mileage unit that saw little riding or maintenance. Early on the engine made a host of ominous noises - knocks, ticks, whines, rattles - and it lacked power. On decelleration the engine knocked so that i thought for sure it was going to throw a bearing. But, it didn't. With maintenance, plenty of riding, use of MMO in the oil and fuel, and not overfilling the crankcase, I have noticed that the noises have subsided substantially. While changing the plugs, I noticed one other thing when shining a light into the combustion chamber - a lot of gunk. My gathering is that many Voyager's do not get ridden often enough or hard enough to vacate this gunk, causing different problems, especially with the hydraulic lifters. A couple days back I pulled a plug and looked again into the chamber only to find it almost shiny clean this time. It has considerably more power than it had before and noises are few. At times I think it sounds like a jet turbine. Just thought I would share with you.

[ghostler]

Hi Ghostler. I have owned my 2001 V12 a couple months now. It is a low mileage unit that saw little riding or maintenance. Early on the engine made a host of ominous noises - knocks, ticks, whines, rattles - and it lacked power. On decelleration the engine knocked so that i thought for sure it was going to throw a bearing. But, it didn't. With maintenance, plenty of riding, use of MMO in the oil and fuel, and not overfilling the crankcase, I have noticed that the noises have subsided substantially. While changing the plugs, I noticed one other thing when shining a light into the combustion chamber - a lot of gunk. My gathering is that many Voyager's do not get ridden often enough or hard enough to vacate this gunk, causing different problems, especially with the hydraulic lifters. A couple days back I pulled a plug and looked again into the chamber only to find it almost shiny clean this time. It has considerably more power than it had before and noises are few. At times I think it sounds like a jet turbine. Just thought I would share with you.

Thanks, Lumpy Rider for the reply. Mine is similar to yours, a low mileage (33,000 mi when I got it) that apparently didn't have much care beyond perhaps the oil changes. In the year that I have had it, already put 9,000 miles on it. I'll follow your advice on MMO both fuel and oil next oil change. I've put enough miles on it since July that time to change should be coming up soon.

I even found the cruise control servo had never been adjusted. Either it is the original, or a replacement. Adjuster was set all the way to the back of threads against the stop, there were no tool marks on the adjuster nuts. My adjustment moved it out almost a half an inch (13 mm). Now it behaves much like a car's cruise control.

I followed the advice of some here and added Seafoam fuel cleaner additive to the tank per instructions. I'm amazed how well that stuff works. By the time I needed to refuel, the idle had stabilized.

So, on to MMO next oil change. Might give it a shot in the fuel before then. I'm also open to anything else I ought to check.