Help broken bolts

[randallar]

Now what!!!!
Help

[doug of so fla]

Should be easily extracted with a type of "easy out" available at any automotive store. You may be able to just use a vice grip, but you stand a very good chance of ruining what you have left that way. If bolt removal set-up does not work the last step is to drill them out, simple but accuracy is a must. Good luck!! let us know how you get it done..

[Avidrider62]

Grind it flat before your drill, Drill center or you'll hit aluminum and that drills to easy. It'll be a mess of a fix.

[dogzz]

i would cut a slot in the screw(with a dremel) so you can use an impact screwdriver ( the kind you hit with a hammer)
Good luck !

[cushman eagle]

In our repair shop,we weld nuts to broken bolts.The heat of welding releases the bolt, and the nut gives you something to drive with.Be careful you only weld on the nut and the stud,not on the case.

[Lucasind]

Heat before attempting removal is key here, as Loren just stated !

[ekap1200]

Heat before attempting removal is key here, as Loren just stated !

By the look of how they broke off, with several threads protruding out past the bore, you have a good chance of getting them out. As Loren and Tony stated a little bit of localized heat , and rap the bolt with a SMALL ! ball-peen hammer to loosen up the threads spraying them with a good penetrating oil. I would then use a small vise-grip and work it back and forth until they loosen. On such a critical engine case if you have never removed broken bolts, this may not be the ones to learn on. Perhaps call in someone who has done this before may be the wise thing to do. Welding a nut also works , but on such a small nut and thread it, in my opinion, would require a tig-machine to do the job. Drilling would be my last resort since there is so much protruding out, but again on such a small bolt drilling in-line with the bolt require's some prior hands on experience and patience. As broken bolts go, these look like a fear factor of only a #4 on a 1 to 10 scale. Good luck don't panic yet

[randallar]

I just went to #4 to #100! Broke the easy out in the screw hole. This thing is in there. I don't have heat but have a flux welder. Can I weld a nut to it without welding to the aluminum? I'm not very good, are there people who come and do this I think this went over my head fast, and now I'm panicking.

[Littlebeaver]

Colbalt drill bits or Norseman drill bits are good to drill out the easyout, I'd buy left handed drill bits, drill it out in reverse, start small then increase the size.. These bits are expensive but now you have a problem , that's what it's gonna take to get it out... I'm hopeful the actual bolt will also unscrew.. that's what I would do anyway...

[randallar]

I went to Menards and got all types of impliments of detruction. Carbind bits and grinding tools. There is something called Rescue Bit, it's suppose to be made for this, will try that next. I think I will do what I originally was going to do on the other one screw. Which is put on a collar and screw into that. Wish me luck.

[ekap1200]

Well that factor of a #4 just went to a number 125. As a machinist and mechanic I have the task of removing various bolts and TAPS that the kids break off in parts at work. A SOLID CARBIDE DRILL BIT, is what is needed now and a way of rigging up a drill guide that will assure a true 90 degree tool path. Also a carbide end mill to put a flat on the broken easy out ( after a drill guide is made up.) Your at a very dangerous point in this task. Were there any signs on the other bolts that someone may have used ( LOCTITE ) on the bolt, or even worse , the wrong grade of loctite ? If so , heat is the only thing that would have softened up the thread lock; and not much, a propane torch would have heated it up enough. If it is just seized from corrosion, heat and penetrating oil and a light rap with a (small ) hammer will do it. That easy out is as tough as a thread tap. If you try to drill it out by hand now' without a drill guide BOLTED down, IT WILL WALK OFF CENTER and ruin this case. Easy outs as they are twisted into the hole have a tendency of pushing the remaining bolt outward making it even tighter in the hole. The smaller the bolt the worse it is to use them. With so much still protruding out; drilling should have been your last resort. Don't rush into anything, all is not lost yet. Gene

[usmalenurse]

I did the same thing about a month ago with the rear fender bracket. Broke the "easy out" off and proceeded to break about every other drill bit that I had trying to drill out the rest of the bolt and the easy out. Found a replacement on Ebay for under $30 shipped and then tried a local machine shop just on a whim. They verified that the cheapest option was to buy the $30 replacement which came in 4 days. A new one was over $130 plus shipping. Just lucky to find one used....Good luck!

[Littlebeaver]

Let us know how it turns out,,, I hope that never happens to me...

[randallar]

Well... I got the easy out removed. I now have to drill out the screw. I will have a full right up of what NOT to do when I get it done.

[Scott-(Altoona, PA)]

Progress is GOOD!

[randallar]

OK I'm done.

I'm going to go through what I went through first and then I'll give my opinion on what NOT to do in this situation.
I pulled the clutch cover because:
1) I wanted to see if my springs were broken, they weren't.
2) I wanted to see how clean the motor was, it was perfect.
3) I wanted to polish the cover, I could have did this on the bike.
So, in other words I didn't have to pull the cover at all. My first mistake. When I started removing the screws they would snap and come loose, no anti-seize and too tight. So when I broke my first one I thought at any moment it was going to snap and come loose, it broke, once that happened I had to remove the cover and another screw broke in the process.
My first instinct was to put a collar on the remaining stud and drill the cover hole out and put the broken screw back in, oh how your first instincts are always right. But I thought I could get this screw out, my second mistake.
Armed with drills, liquid wrench, butane torch and easy outs I started. It drilled pretty well and the extractor grabbed pretty well but the butane torch could not get it hot enough. The aluminum dissipated the heat too fast and just wouldn't cut it. So a little pressure was used, a little too much and the extractor broke off. My third mistake. Back to Menards for all kinds of implements of destruction. Drills were useless, the only thing I found that only half way worked were small grinding stones for a dremel, the blue ones. As I worked slipping off made the hole in the aluminum larger and larger. Still not getting anywhere I bit the big one and paid $45 for a Rescue Bit. It started out fine, maybe my drill was too fast I had it on the lowest setting, but it started out great for about 2 mins then dulled and I got nothing more from it. It had 2 sides so I flipped it over and being even more careful after 2 more minutes the same thing. In the mean time this thing would go through aluminum like hot butter and my hole was now really big. My fourth mistake. Back to the grinding stone. I finally got it down to just a little tip of the extractor it would even spin when you were grinding on it. But it was not coming out. So I drilled beside it and used the Rescue Bit to grind at the side of it, after the Bit broke 4 times it was finally gone.
That only left drilling out the screw and re tapping the hole. By the time I was done there wasn't much left of the screw or the aluminum. I never really got the screw out, it beat me at every turn. I put the cover on and as a guide drilled and tapped the hole. It was too far gone by this time and was not going to hold. Not even with a longer screw. These actually go all the way through and come out the back. So I put anti seize on the screw put it in the hole filled the hole with J B Weld and let it sit. I turned the screw out and it looked pretty good. A gave it another day to cure and re tapped the hole. Bought a longer SS screw put Loctite on it and hoped for the best. It tightened down.
The other screw, I did what I should have done in the first place and took a screw connector and ground it down in a cylinder shape so it would fit in an 11/32 hole, drilled out the cover hole, ground down the broken screw and inserted it right back in. Too easy.
So this is what I've learned, steel bolt in aluminum:
1) Make sure you really need to do this.
2) If you feel it's going to break, STOP let a pro do it. They have real torches.
3) If you can't afford to have them do it and it breaks don't try to extract it. Use reverse drill bits, center the bit and drill it out. Then tap it.
4) If you didn't read this and get into the mess that I did, just keep grinding and grinding. It will come out in a month or so.
5) Don't waste your money on tools that promise the world. Just keep grinding.

While I was down there grinding away I looked up and seen this:

This is the fuel pump with nothing covering the circuit board. I will never get done with just the maintenance on this bike. The motor was in great shape but nothing else was maintained at all. At this point maybe June.

[Littlebeaver]

Wow, I just installed a couple of heli coils into my cylinder head on my 1100, two of the valve cover holes got stripped out some how because someone I know got too rambunctious with tightening it, I'll just blame the PO..LOL glad you got it repaired...... Comes with a tap and a nice guide tool. Just like new again, with these you should have no fear of anything ever again.......

[doug of so fla]

I would guess that someone either used loctite on them or just gorilla wrenched them on. One thing to learn from this as many have, steel bolts into alum you MUST use a torque wrench!!!!! and go by the spec's in the manual!!! disimilar metals react differently and heat expands metal but the type of alum used does not and stays that way because it is mfg'd to dissipate heat.. I would remove them now and remove the loctite you put on them. imho.. There are certain bolts on the XII, when the manual gives a torque value, or loctite type, you better use it or you will be there again. The brake caliper bolts are another one that has to use the correct torque. ANY flange type bolt you need to use torque wrench as the flange is the reason it will not come off when it is to tight, it just locks it in. Unless you are very familar working with these type of fasteners & other items it is best to consult the manual. And always use a 6 pt socket. Someone like Carl or Gene Kap who has done these for years are about the only ones who could do these by feel. Takes a lot of experience and you can still get one stuck..

[Littlebeaver]

thanks for the post and the story, I enjoyed it....

[randallar]

The only bolt I used Loctite on was the one in the JB Weld. I ALWAYS use anti seize on steel to aluminum bolts. Nothing left to put a helicoil in it was gone. There is no torque in the manual just shows the bolt. Thanks Randy