Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
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- ghostler
- Grand Tourer
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- Current bike(s): 2001 Voyager XII, 1971 Honda CB100
Asphalt, the final frontier; these are the treks of the Kawasaki Voyager; its continuing mission to explore strange new roads, to seek out new sites, new bed & breakfasts, to boldly ride where no one has ridden before. - Location: Clovis, NM
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Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
I had a case of noisy valve lifters on my 2001 XII on one ride two years ago that scared the Dickens out of me. (Sorry, I love Charles Dickens' stories. ) Since then, I've ridden may be another 10,000 miles without much ado.
About 800 miles into a ride, engine was making a loud clattering at 70 mph, 20 miles from my son's house, where I was stopping. I pulled over to a McDonalds, let it cool, was still clattering. I took side roads at no more than 35 mph to his house. When I opened the oil drain plugs, oil poured out with little viscosity like it was water. I had made the mistake of changing using oil that apparently was at least 10 years old. Just in that 800 miles riding, oil apparently broke down from heat and turned really thin.
It splashed out of the oil drain pan like it was water, weird.
I put 3 quarts and 11 ounces of standard 10W40 motor oil in the bike, and 11 ounces of Lucas. Engine was now running quieter, clatter was completely gone. (This was before I learned from this forum that Rotella was a better oil to use.)
Rode close to 1,000 miles home back to New Mexico. Since then as of late, I've noticed on a few cold starts, the unusual tappet noise like one lifter wasn't fully filling with oil like it should, goes away after a rev with oil warm up and doesn't appear on the rest of the ride, unless we stop and bike rests and cools for a couple hours. (Sounds like the sticking lifters on our old 1964 Ford Falcon with 200 cubic inch in-line 6 with hydraulic lifters. I fixed that by removing the lifters, disassembling, degumming in volatile solvent soak, reassembling. That was in high school in the early 1970's. )
I'm thinking of adding Seafoam or may be something a little stronger like STP fuel treatment to the oil. I suspect that somewhere in its previous past it may have not had the oil changes it should have had, and there is some oil spooge gumming inside the lifters.
I know this will raise the eyebrows of some, but for the past 10,000 miles, since that incident, I've been using Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer in my oil changes. There used to be a recommendation on the back that stated it was great for Harley-Davidson and other motorcycles. Recommendation was 20% in motorcycles with dry clutches, 10% for wet clutches. Latest bottles no longer have motorcycle recommendations.
I was using it in my 1986 Suzuki LS650 Savage. One winter during several weeks of non-use, I removed the head cover on the air cooled engine to do some work. The entire overhead cam chamber was glistening as with a wet coating of oil like the engine was just run, so their statement about preventing damage from dry starts is true. I knew the difference from my opening the head cover previous to Lucas use. It was an eye opener.
Over time though, the Suzuki started developing a slipping clutch in 4th gear (top gear, bike's 4 speed was wide ratio, only 300 rpm difference in top gear compared with the later 5 speed). I discontinued the Lucas and after an oil change or two the slippage stopped. So, if any are having slippage problems and suspect their particular oil or additive, just letting you know that sometimes just going back to OEM oil recommendations can fix the slippage issue.
So far, haven't had any problems with the Lucas. Going back to my first question, has anybody been adding a solvent based fuel cleaner to their crankcase oil to help clean oil passages and lifters? How well did it work? What ones do you recommend?
About 800 miles into a ride, engine was making a loud clattering at 70 mph, 20 miles from my son's house, where I was stopping. I pulled over to a McDonalds, let it cool, was still clattering. I took side roads at no more than 35 mph to his house. When I opened the oil drain plugs, oil poured out with little viscosity like it was water. I had made the mistake of changing using oil that apparently was at least 10 years old. Just in that 800 miles riding, oil apparently broke down from heat and turned really thin.
It splashed out of the oil drain pan like it was water, weird.
I put 3 quarts and 11 ounces of standard 10W40 motor oil in the bike, and 11 ounces of Lucas. Engine was now running quieter, clatter was completely gone. (This was before I learned from this forum that Rotella was a better oil to use.)
Rode close to 1,000 miles home back to New Mexico. Since then as of late, I've noticed on a few cold starts, the unusual tappet noise like one lifter wasn't fully filling with oil like it should, goes away after a rev with oil warm up and doesn't appear on the rest of the ride, unless we stop and bike rests and cools for a couple hours. (Sounds like the sticking lifters on our old 1964 Ford Falcon with 200 cubic inch in-line 6 with hydraulic lifters. I fixed that by removing the lifters, disassembling, degumming in volatile solvent soak, reassembling. That was in high school in the early 1970's. )
I'm thinking of adding Seafoam or may be something a little stronger like STP fuel treatment to the oil. I suspect that somewhere in its previous past it may have not had the oil changes it should have had, and there is some oil spooge gumming inside the lifters.
I know this will raise the eyebrows of some, but for the past 10,000 miles, since that incident, I've been using Lucas Heavy Duty Oil Stabilizer in my oil changes. There used to be a recommendation on the back that stated it was great for Harley-Davidson and other motorcycles. Recommendation was 20% in motorcycles with dry clutches, 10% for wet clutches. Latest bottles no longer have motorcycle recommendations.
I was using it in my 1986 Suzuki LS650 Savage. One winter during several weeks of non-use, I removed the head cover on the air cooled engine to do some work. The entire overhead cam chamber was glistening as with a wet coating of oil like the engine was just run, so their statement about preventing damage from dry starts is true. I knew the difference from my opening the head cover previous to Lucas use. It was an eye opener.
Over time though, the Suzuki started developing a slipping clutch in 4th gear (top gear, bike's 4 speed was wide ratio, only 300 rpm difference in top gear compared with the later 5 speed). I discontinued the Lucas and after an oil change or two the slippage stopped. So, if any are having slippage problems and suspect their particular oil or additive, just letting you know that sometimes just going back to OEM oil recommendations can fix the slippage issue.
So far, haven't had any problems with the Lucas. Going back to my first question, has anybody been adding a solvent based fuel cleaner to their crankcase oil to help clean oil passages and lifters? How well did it work? What ones do you recommend?
George Hostler
Clovis, NM, US
Christian Motorcycle Association
Salvation Army Motorcycle Ministry, Western Territory
http://tsammcentral.org/
2001 Kawasaki ZG1200 Voyager XII
1971 Honda CB100
Clovis, NM, US
Christian Motorcycle Association
Salvation Army Motorcycle Ministry, Western Territory
http://tsammcentral.org/
2001 Kawasaki ZG1200 Voyager XII
1971 Honda CB100
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- Cruiser
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Re: Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
Just my two cents worth. I have used sea foam type products and marvel mystery oil in the crankcase oil to clean varnish/carbon out of engines, and quiet lifters. It worked, no problem. However that was V-8, car engine, tractor etc. never tried it on a motorcycle. The difference would be the oil clutch on the motorcycle. The oil additives are more of a detergent/solvent, not a friction modifier, so shouldn't bother the clutch.
- cranky
- King of the Road
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Re: Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
... I think Mobil 1 makes a motorcycle specific 10-40 oil, it will be my next crankcase,
if you run synthetic oil, your machine will be spotless inside... JM2C
if you run synthetic oil, your machine will be spotless inside... JM2C
'03 Voyager - http://tinyurl.com/mqtgpwp VROC pics of Gina
Cranky - Bill Snodgrass AVA # 6544. VROC # 16804
Cranked >128K miles, Mtn bike-no motor!!!
San Jose, KalEfornYa
Cranky - Bill Snodgrass AVA # 6544. VROC # 16804
Cranked >128K miles, Mtn bike-no motor!!!
San Jose, KalEfornYa
- doug of so fla
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Re: Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
"Seafoam" Simply works, it has been proven to work in Kaws and many other M/C's & engines . For fuel & oil. Use as directed & make sure you have TOTAL of 3qts 22oz of oil & Seafoam in crank case. Use in fuel at same time. will clean out engine as good as it can be.. do a couple of "SHORT" oil changes ,2 or 3 at about 1000mi + or -. Then regular change maybe once or twice . If varnish & carbon is your problem it should clear it up.
I have never used Lucas but it should do a similar good job. SEAFOAM has a proven record.. +++ Good luck
I have never used Lucas but it should do a similar good job. SEAFOAM has a proven record.. +++ Good luck
doug of no fla
- ghostler
- Grand Tourer
- Posts: 519
- Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:44 pm
- 11
- Current bike(s): 2001 Voyager XII, 1971 Honda CB100
Asphalt, the final frontier; these are the treks of the Kawasaki Voyager; its continuing mission to explore strange new roads, to seek out new sites, new bed & breakfasts, to boldly ride where no one has ridden before. - Location: Clovis, NM
- Has liked: 2 times
- Been liked: 10 times
- Contact:
Re: Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
Thanks, Doug for the inputs. How much Seafoam should I use?
George Hostler
Clovis, NM, US
Christian Motorcycle Association
Salvation Army Motorcycle Ministry, Western Territory
http://tsammcentral.org/
2001 Kawasaki ZG1200 Voyager XII
1971 Honda CB100
Clovis, NM, US
Christian Motorcycle Association
Salvation Army Motorcycle Ministry, Western Territory
http://tsammcentral.org/
2001 Kawasaki ZG1200 Voyager XII
1971 Honda CB100
- doug of so fla
- Grand Tourer
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- Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2008 6:17 pm
- 16
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Re: Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
They have good directions on the Seafoam container.
doug of no fla
- Tonyvdb
- Grand Tourer
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1996 Voyager (Just sold)
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Re: Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
I also recommend Sea foam, been using it for years and never had an issue. I will be using it in my new bike as well.
2017 Gloss black Victory Vision
1996 Kawasaki Voyager Just sold
1981 Kawasaki GPZ550 (sold)
1996 Kawasaki Voyager Just sold
1981 Kawasaki GPZ550 (sold)
- SgtSlag
- King of the Road
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(2006-2012: 1979 Honda CB750K)
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Re: Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
In 2006, I bought a 1979 Honda CB750. I added SeaFoam to the crankcsae, caramel-colored oil. Ran it idling, shifting through all five gears, for five minutes. Oil reached 250º F, operating temp. Drained it: came out black as coal...
Three years and 9,000 miles later, I repeated tbe process: oil came out same caramel color, no change. Bike used SG oil when it came out; I only used SM oils in it. The sludge was residue from its early days; the more modern oils left no deposits, even though the engine ran at their thermal limit of 250º F (well, that was the thermal limit of API SG oils, anyway).
Is it worth it? YES, once. After that, probably not. Won't hurt anything, will get rid of deposits, if any.
Make certain you open BOTH drain plugs to remove ALL old oil... Too much oil will cause your described issue. SeaFoam will NOT affect your wet clutch, other tban to remove sludge from it. Cheers!
Three years and 9,000 miles later, I repeated tbe process: oil came out same caramel color, no change. Bike used SG oil when it came out; I only used SM oils in it. The sludge was residue from its early days; the more modern oils left no deposits, even though the engine ran at their thermal limit of 250º F (well, that was the thermal limit of API SG oils, anyway).
Is it worth it? YES, once. After that, probably not. Won't hurt anything, will get rid of deposits, if any.
Make certain you open BOTH drain plugs to remove ALL old oil... Too much oil will cause your described issue. SeaFoam will NOT affect your wet clutch, other tban to remove sludge from it. Cheers!
SgtSlag
1993 Voyager XII
1993 Voyager XII
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Re: Adding Cleaning Agent to Oil Worth It?
Whatever oil you choose to use for refill, be sure the JASO-MA designation is on the jug, that means it is considered safe by Japanese manufacturers for use with wet clutches. Rotella T4 fits this category.
Returning neglected Kawasakis to glory since 2014
1991 Voyager XII "Xaviera"
1998 Concours "Connimus Prime"
1989 454 LTD "Merlin"
1991 Voyager XII "Xaviera"
1998 Concours "Connimus Prime"
1989 454 LTD "Merlin"