84 delays turning on for a minute or two!!

[bigsixkawa]

Hi
Any help would be greatly appreciated. I bough this bike last year and it runs great. Last year I had some issues and thought I solved by moving relays around... but now I think it's heat related. When I turn the key to accessory all works fine, but when I turn to the main on, I get nothing... dash doesn't light up and I don't hear fuel pump pressure up. Eventually it will turn on , but may take 5 seconds, one minute or may take 10 minutes. It seems worse in the high heat we are having this week here in southern Ontario. any ideas would be appreciated! It looks like a previous owner has put di-electric? grease on all connectors so this may not be new unless all bikes have it. Also wondering about shims for a valve adjustment? It only has 62,000 KM's, so wondering if it's needed and how would I tell?
Raymond

[Van Voyager]

I made the mistake of using some silicon based dielectric grease on the connectors of an old Honda. Turns out the silicon in the grease can turn to silicon-dioxide which apparently is a very good insulator. After some research where I found Porsche had stopped using silicone based dielectric grease because of conductor issues, I tried to to 'wash' out as much of the silicone dielectric from the connectors using naphthalene (I know: a bit dodgy) as I could, then used CLR to remove the oxidation of the metal pins. Even after that, I've had to replace just about all the connector pins on the bike -not fun.

If you've got a non-silicone based dielectric grease (there is such a thing) on your connectors then you're probably fine.
In my case, the brown colour of the 'brass' connector pins was a telltale sign that they were oxidizing.

[bigsixkawa]

Thanks Van , I'll have a look at the connectors! A little more info... I turn on the key, dash stays dark, running lights don't come on, fuel pump does not run and starter may or may not turn over. If starter does work it won't start, but may fire briefly for a second or two as I'm thinking it burns off any existing gas, so it sounds like I have spark (I'll check that out). I'm worried its the DFI box. I use a battery maintainer when it's parked in garage.

[jorgeno]

Sounds like you will have to open your ignition switch and check the connections. Seems to be bad contact when turning to main.

Check the valves every 6000KM. It’s the only way to now

[Me Again]

A couple of easy checks will be
When you turn on the switch ,move the handlebars back and forth to see if you have any obvious reaction .This may help eliminate switch wiring.
Remove and clean all the connectors to the fairing .The systems you describe could easily be attributed to these connectors.
As for the shims . The most noticeable indicator is the bike gets harder to start the colder it is .Usually not a problem in the summer but as the temps drop it will become noticeable until the bike will refuse to start .Since this is hopefully a winter project this makes a good check.
Most of the bikes I have owned need them set around 45K to 55K miles (70ish K kilometers )although I do know some have never had to change them .

[bigsixkawa]

I've tried jiggling and wiggling pretty much everything, I seem to get the best response when playing with relays under the right side cover, but even this doesn't always work... I just leave the key on and eventually it will come to life. Last week in the heat it took about 10 minutes... my main relay was getting pretty hot as it's pulled in during this. At home once its cooled off and on maintainer.... it works almost all the time. I wonder if its an electrical transistor or diode somewhere that doesn't like low voltage and if so is the DFI the only place such an animal would be or is there other computers? I guess the question is who tells the dash and fuel pump to turn on once the key is turned on. Hazards work, but running lights stay off. clock light comes on... but dash lights and neutral light etc are dead until it magically turns on afetr waiting....

[Me Again]

Some years back I had a 1300 that would not start.Spent many hours tracking wires all over the place and could never pinpoint a problem even though I could find a open spot when I tracked it back everything showed good including the original spot.
I was about to change the harness (computer worked fine in a different bike) when I decided to try one more thing.
I started checking every wire connector in the main plug for tightness and found one single pin that was loose . after pinching it tight and reconnecting every thing I had loose the bike started right up .In all fairness my problem started with a bad relay and the one I replaced it with and left an empty spot that got hot and caused the pin to loose it's grip.When I touched the wire to check it I would make contact but by the time I would check down stream it would loose it again .
I did have a running parts bike so checking back and forth was a little easier.

[Van Voyager]

Some years back I had a 1300 that would not start.Spent many hours tracking wires all over the place and could never pinpoint a problem even though I could find a open spot when I tracked it back everything showed good including the original spot.
.....I decided to try one more thing. I started checking every wire connector in the main plug for tightness and found one single pin that was loose . after pinching it tight and reconnecting every thing.....

Just went through something similar last week on my 86 with the exact same fix. I had no power to rear accessory leads. After much troubleshooting, discovered a female connector pin that did not 'mate' with the mail pin. Once I bent the female contacts in, all was well. Was that way from the factory.

[bigsixkawa]

Thanks Me Again and Van. When you say main plug is that the DFI connector or the ones up into the fairing? I have a bad horn relay as well... any wisdom on relays? Do I need to replace with an exact same or is there a newer type that will fit that works? its the big 056700-5260 22a type.

[Me Again]

Yes I meant the DFI .
As for the relays You can get them at a good price on fleabay or try one of these I believe an older model Toyota used the same one .
NAPA #AR355 or GP Sorensen #41-5002

[bigsixkawa]

Well I think I figured it out! (fingers crossed). I went out and got two new relays, one for the horn and as I usually do with some things I got an extra. (thanks for the part number at NAPA Me Again). The horn had bothered me as I always had 12 volts and could hear the relay click but no horn. When I took another battery and hard wired the horn it worked and since I had my head down next to it.. scared the you know what out of me! Thats loud close up! So I put in the new relay for the horn and everything started to work fine. Then a light came on in my head.. lets try a new relay for the main relay on the other side. Luckily at that time the delay in everything turning on was happening.. so turn in the key nothing.. put in new relay and turn key .. everything lit up! put back old relay.. nothing.. new relay lights!! I even tried the lighting relay beside it and nothing came on... new relay everything works.. Conclusion The Main relay just like the horn motor probably pulls a lot of juice and the old relays are probably pitted and worn out after 34 years (go figure). Looks like I'm going back to Napa and replace them all as even though the others work, it may just be a matter of time before they start to fail. I'm thinking of testing resistance across the secondary on the old ones when actuated with a battery to see how much the difference is compared to the new ones. Thanks for all the replies and advice!!

[Me Again]

I do not know if I would replace them all but having a couple of spares never hurts

[bigsixkawa]

Yes a couple spares should do at $20 plus tax a pop! I did do a resistance check on the old compared to new on a Fluke meter. 0.2 ohms on old ones 0.1 on new. This assumes I tested correctly. Not much difference... but so far no re-occurance!

[Van Voyager]

NAPA #AR355 or GP Sorensen #41-5002

Good to know. Thanks for posting. Will have to find a couple of those just to have some spares on hand.