Which Voyager?

[Klutch]

I joined the AVA because I am planning on purchasing a Voyager XII on Sat. July 27. There are several good choices, and I thought it would be fun to get the wisdom of you folks in helping me decide which Voyager to buy. A little about me: I am 6' 4", 300#, a real Sasquatch. My wife is 5' 4" and awfully attractive. I have a 1996 Honda PC800 Pacific Coast, bought 9 years ago with 11K miles and now has 49K miles. It's been a terrific bike for solo commuting, but now we want a bike that is comfortable for the 2 of us. I want to commute to work solo and do some pleasure riding with my wife, some occasional weekends riding with friends. The Voyager XII appears to be the right price point, reliability and comfort to make that happen. I live in Central IL. The bikes are all at least 2 hours away, some as many as 4 1/2 hours away. I'm willing to drive for the right bike and bargain. Contender A: https://desmoines.craigslist.org/mcy/d/ ... 77508.html This bike is the right mileage/age at the right price. It has the Progressive shocks and fork springs, Corbin seat. The only thing I don't like is the color (I prefer brighter colors for safety sake). Weirdness with this bike - the exhaust has single tips on each side, not duals. What's up with that? Also has the service manuals, a big plus.Contender B: https://appleton.craigslist.org/mcy/d/o ... 01552.html, Less than 15K miles! My wife's favorite. Beautiful machine. Probably can get the price down a bit, it's been advertised for over a month. Only weird thing is that the owner removed the passenger radio controls, but I think we can live with that. Easy enough to add if the wiring isn't buggered up.Contender C: https://desmoines.craigslist.org/mcy/d/ ... 84306.html, another beautiful machine with 2 seats. One of them has to make the wife happy right? However, also the furthest away from me. Is the drive worth it? Contender D:https://chicago.craigslist.org/nwi/mcy/ ... 36735.html, closest to me, plain jane bike with no add-ons but the mileage and price are reasonable. Overall I like the bikes with the aftermarket seats. If we don't like it, we can always go back to the stock seat, they're available on ebay. New aftermarket seats are pretty hard to find for this bike now. I'm handy enough that I can add the progressive suspension to any bike I buy in a year or two. What's your vote? Advice appreciated!

[Nails]

Others here will have more to say -- my preferences probably are different from yours. Here are just a few things I noticed.

Contender A: right mileage/age at the right price. It has the Progressive shocks and fork springs, Corbin seat. ... Weirdness with this bike - the exhaust has single tips on each side, not duals. What's up with that? Also has the service manuals, a big plus.

$2300 Great shape and running condition. Well maintained. New battery, shocks, motor oil Good tires Corbin seat 2 Helmets\nShop manual

I'm not sure the Corbin seat is a plus -- more below. I suspect that's a Cobra exhaust, which some like but others think is too loud. Service manuals are available on this site, but paper editions would be a plus. Maintenance records? What kind of "new shocks "?

Contender B: Less than 15K miles! Only weird thing is that the owner removed the passenger radio controls, but I think we can live with that.

$3400 Tires have lots of tread on them. Radio works great and volume increases with speed. Low miles at under 15,000. See images for odometer readout. Fresh full synthetic oil change. Comes with spare windshield Has cover 3 Kawasaki soft luggage custom fit for trunk and saddlebags Adjustable drivers backrest Always stored in a climate controlled garage and stored with non-ethanol gas. Overall a very clean bike that's been kept in great shape it's whole life. Please let me know if you have any questions. Call or text 920 420 six six six three.

The low mileage isn 't necessarily such a big deal, given that these typically go a long way. Not having been used much might even be a liability. Tire age? That "soft luggage" presumably refers to stock liners, suggesting they weren't used very much. I've never seen these in the flesh. For my part, I removed the radio controls, as well as the whole radio including the "second story" on the left switchset. But also as mentioned, I'm maybe not the best one to ask.

Contender C: another beautiful machine with 2 seats.

$3100 2002 Kawasaki Voyager XII Touring. 30,600 miles. New tires. Mint condition. Additional touring seat with backrest included. Owned by a former Kawasaki dealer. Ask for Dave

Price too high. I can't help but notice that despite having a Corbin, he's actually using the stock seat. Should have maintenance records.

Contender D: plain jane bike with no add-ons but the mileage and price are reasonable.

$2550\n2001 Kaw. Voyager VII 27,318 miles ,Air ride , Am/FM , cruse control ,Tires like new, Bike runs very well call

"Air ride" is a liability, not an asset: the stock air forks suck. "Plain Jane" could be an asset if the alternative is useless farkles.

Overall I like the bikes with the aftermarket seats.

think all of these are over-priced and recommend looking in a different market -- but you did pick high-end examples. Check out viewtopic.php?f=15&t=12118 as an example. All of these have low mileage for age, bringing into question maintenance (age, not just miles) and things like rotten plastic/rubber (like tires, which often rot before they wear out). You'll want to verify that the cruise control works -- but many common problems are easy to fix or adjust away (you have to remove the fairing). As mentioned, the stock forks suck, and most folks go with Progressives, an essential upgrade. Although opinions vary, I think the stock shocks are great, if you change the oil. This is a chore, but (IMHO) an essential maintenance item. No CB radios (which I would just take off anyway -- don't need no stinking radios). You might be over-rating the aftermarket seats, but I think a backrest is essential for big mile touring. Auxillary driving lights would be a welcome add-on. These bike typically perform poorly with Dunlop D404's on the front, a common tire for this bike. I changed mine long before its time.

[SgtSlag]

I recommend A or D. Corbin seats are usually custom-built to the rider and passenger specifications: inseam, height, weight, etc. They typically won't be comfortable for anyone other than the person they were made for...
The prices for A and D are reasonable, IMO.

With regards to low mileage, on an older bike... In 2006, I purchased a 1979 Honda CB750K, with 9,600 miles on the odometer. We rode that bike, two up, 98% of the time, heavily loaded, touring. We rode it 1,935 miles from our home, circling Lake Superior, in 2009, when the bike was 30 years old, with just 12,000 miles on it; it was just us, on one bike, no support along the way, no traveling companions in a car, or on another bike... It ran perfectly. It developed a slow head gasket seal leak, just before I sold it, in 2012. I added an oil cooler, with a thermostat, and a spin-on oil filter adapter. They never leaked, never had an issue with them. Sold it because we bought our Voyager XII in 2010, and we never rode it much, as the XII was much more comfortable, with far more room for both of us, and it had vastly more power.

I honestly think all four bikes are great bikes, but A and D better price, and no custom seats which won't work for you.
We drove three hours up, to go look at our XII. I took a trailer, just in case. I would not ride it home as I did not have a chance to go through it, or do a lengthy test drive. Take a trailer. If you want to ride it home, go ahead, but have your wife stay close with the trailer, just in case.
Change fluids, when you get it home. I mean, every single one -- don't overlook anything. Fill it with alcohol-free gasoline, and run some SeaFoam through the tank (1 oz. per gallon, or 6.5 oz, roughly -- there is plenty of room for fudge factor, as SeaFoam won't harm it, even if you ran it on pure SeaFoam).
If the tires are Dunlop 404's, plan on replacing them ASAP. There are far better tires -- don't wait for the crappy tires to wear out! Tires are too important to save a few dollars on rubber, and spend buckets of cash on hospital bills, or funeral expenses...
There are a number of modifications you can do to the bike, to improve performance: Progressive Fork Springs and rear Shocks; convert the lights to LED's (frees up amperes on the alternator, so you can add a plug-in for USB devices, like charging your phone, or powering your GPS system); LED headlight and auxiliary lights on the engine guard bars; aftermarket windshield with a large vent, to get more air flow for the driver; highway floor boards; and more.

Good luck, with whichever bike you choose. Cheers!

[Mr Jensee]

I am chiming in. If you weigh 300lbs. I would opt for one with either an extra seat or with an after market fitted. Reason is I weigh now 255lbs and after riding for a couple of hours compressing that foam gets painful. Kept in a garage controlled environment is a plus and anything north of 20.000 miles is also a plus. Which ever one you choose make sure the owner has service records. Even if he is changing the fluids himself. Also I agree that the air suspension in NOT an asset. By now they probably leak air and progressive springs will bring yo a better ride. And before I turn this over to people who probably know more, the aftermarket and extra seat would probably cost you an additional $500 to $600 extra American if bought a machine without them. And BTW what you pay for a used motorcycle at least 20 years old is only whether or not you believe you've got your money's worth. Dont be challenged by having others say you paid too much.

[Nails]

The last Corbin seat I rode on (a 1980 BMW R80G/S) was worst than my stock Kawa seat. A lot worse, actually -- on par with my dirt bike, which is much like a 2X4! I doubt it was custom, but don't know -- it sure wasn't made for me. I just had a really bad experience with Corbin -- I genuinely consider them a liability.

If neither the stock nor Corbin seats work ... I use beads ($15) over a sheepskin (already had) over an Airhawk (I paid $120). Kinda overkill, but $135 (just the driver). And you might like the little bit of extra seat height (I have 32" inseam).

Last week I rode more than 1000 miles in one day, including more than 600 miles only stopping when a full tank went to E. I left on that month-long trip thinking the sheepskin and beads would be enough, but bought the Airhawk on the road. I'll take the Airhawk off until my next long ride. One could get a better price on it (than I found at the first dealer who had them on hand); plus there are Brand-X alternatives that run only $30-40, per recommendations I got from other riders using them.

I don't think you can evaluate a seat until you've ridden through a whole tank of gas. My butt did a lot better after the first couple days. So, even if there's a little pain toward the end of that first tank, it'll probably be fine on a multi-day trip.

I think a backrest is more important than all of this.

I can't ride anything for any distance without earplugs. But I cut off most of my windshield -- think of it as a "large vent for increased airflow to the rider" .

[SgtSlag]

Just the wind, without any other noise, at highway speeds, is loud enough to cause permanent hearing loss. We wear custom ear plugs every ride, have used ear plugs since 2006. Road noise, alone, causes tremendous stress when riding. The ear plugs, 28 dB+, reduce road noise, and allow the rider to be much more relaxed -- it is amazing, actually, how much more relaxed you are, with ear plugs.

Yes, you can still hear traffic, horns, squealing tires, sirens, and everything else. They will preserve your hearing for years to come. The more relaxed you are, the more capable you are of reacting to situations while riding. It is also so very much more enjoyable. The stress of road noise will tire you out, physically, much faster than if you wear ear plugs. Try some foam ear plugs, to see how much better it really is; we found that they really start to hurt, after five hours -- custom ear plugs begin to hurt after wearing them 6+ hours, for three consecutive days... I recommend custom molded ear plugs, professionally made: $120/pair. Worth every penny, just for the relaxation; my hearing ability is priceless, to me.

Custom seats are fantastic, if you never swap drivers... We do, so that is not an option for us, as we are built totally different in height, weight, inseam, etc. We have used different seat covers, trying to find the best one: sheepskin (real, NOT synthetic); wooden beads; an Airhawk (never worked for us, no matter how much/little air we put into it); a purple-colored sewing seat cushion (inflatable, has bumps on its surface); and a Purple brand, mesh, soft rubber cushion. Of these, we found the Purple brand to be the best; the purple-colored, inflatable sewing seat cover ranks 2nd; the wooden beads rank 3rd; the sheepskin ranks 4th, only superior to the factory seat.

Your experience will likely be unique to you, and your wife. Seats are not something I would use to make a bike purchase decision. I've heard many a comment on Corbin seats: some love them, the rest hate them. The comment that they are like sitting upon a 2x4, is common.

For some insightful information on why we get sore riding motorcycles for a long period of time, visit Craig Vetter's Magic Seat web page. He explains what is happening to us, and why. His Magic Seat board is ultra-inexpensive, but it has limitations, and drawbacks... Read carefully, give it full consideration. I tried it, but it did not work very well for me. I may not have been using it properly, either. It's a fun little experiment, however. It will cost you less than $20 to try.

If you want a custom seat, and you will not be swapping positions on the bike, spend the money. If you want to try less expensive alternatives, I would highly recommend you start with either an Airhawk, or the Purple brand. The others only help a modest amount. Cheers!