Won't start

Post by **Godlover** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 3:22 pm

Yesterday I tried to start my "new to me" Voyager. It did fire a few times but just couldn't get it started. I let it sit and tried later - no luck. Pete sent these instruction on the General Chat forum - so I tried first thing this morning - no luck. It didn't even fire. The choke was stuck open first thing this morning so I tried to push it open with a screw driver. Once I moved the throttle - the choke opened. It stuck open later - and same thing - open throttle - choke unsticks. I don't like starter fluid but am considering it. Do I need to remove air cleaner before I try it or can I just spray into the air intake? I wonder if I flooded it to the point where the cylinders are washed down and there is no compression.

I don't have to get it running as we still have a ton of snow and a lot of sand on the streets so I won't be riding.

Thanks - Mark

Post by **Godlover** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 3:35 pm

Reading down through the forums - maybe it is the fuel pump? Is there an easy way to check the fuel pump?

Post by **DaveMac** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 4:32 pm

This is going to sound silly but did you check your fuses>? When I turn my ignition on I can hear my fuel pump clicking. (In my opinion starter fluid should be used on lawn mowers and snow blowers can cause a world of problems.) I don’t know of an easy way to the pump some one like Carl could answer that he is wonderful to talk to just give him a call.

Post by **David (N. Alabama)** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:12 pm

I suggest you drain the carb bowls into a clean cup and look for debris. Then with the drains open and the drain hose in a bucket turn on the bike and hit the starter to see if fuel gets pumped out through the drains.

If you found debris you might want to replace the fuel filter.

Also, is the fuel tank full? If not top it off to the flat ledge you see inside the filler neck. Might be a good time to add some seafoam also.

Post by **Gator Mike** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 12:21 am

Might try making sure your battery is full. Mine would turn over but not start. Checked the battery and found it to be really low of electolite. Added distilled water and it fired up every time. Guess it had enough juice to turn over but not enought to do that and fire also. May not be your problem but it's cheap to find out......good luck.........Gator Mike

Post by **Godlover** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 12:50 am

For a moment this afternoon I almost had it started. I left it sit from this morning and it fired a bit but then just went back to cranking. I will give it a whirl tomorrow. I do have a full tank of gas - and I have plenty of battery - it is on a battery tender. It is still chilly in the garage so I don't want to spend too much time doing wrench work. I think once it starts I'll be okay. Seems to me that it could use a set of plugs - again - don't want to wrench right now! Thanks for all the great advice!!

Post by **DaveMac** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 1:11 am

Ok but put this in your memory banks, remove the spark plug wires. If you get just the wire and not the connector don’t worry they screw back on. At least mine did. But you may have a lose connection at the plugs. Mine ran like crap sputtered and popped. When I pulled the wire the connector stayed on the plug. I had to pull it off and screw it back on the wire. (I had to get wires) but the bike ran with this the quick fix.

Post by **Godlover** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 2:38 am

DaveMac wrote:Ok but put this in your memory banks, remove the spark plug wires. If you get just the wire and not the connector don’t worry they screw back on. At least mine did. But you may have a lose connection at the plugs. Mine ran like crap sputtered and popped. When I pulled the wire the connector stayed on the plug. I had to pull it off and screw it back on the wire. (I had to get wires) but the bike ran with this the quick fix.

Thanks - I'll keep that in mind!!

Post by **suzib6sw** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 3:19 am

My '86 is having similar issues at the moment..
Choke on.. crank for 10 secs..
Close Choke, no throttle.. crank and pops and splutters..
Bearing in mind that mine has basically stood since 03..
Anyway, faux tank off.. Open air filter (CAREFULLY).. Look inside and make mental note of whats in there and how its oriented..
There was/is originally a white plastic frame which held a paper filter and there are two plastic sticks with a U at both ends one longer than the other to help keep the filter in place against the top of the filter box..Get them round the wrong way and they WILL break.. No Biggie..
Other bikes have this missing but have some paper filter in there..
Take it out..
Spray carb cleaner or starter towards the rear of the box and crank.. No Choke and open the throttle slightly.. It will catch as the vapours get sucked in assuming the plugs arent soaked..
Then its just a case of getting the throttle in the right place and balance the choke and keep it running.. :-)

In my case.. Number 1 has issues till the bike is warm. Not sure why as I have had the carbs off, cleaned properly..and measured and balanced..
Once warm, there is an occasional misfire on #1 but the pickup on the throttle is instant and strong... Better than the '94 that I ride normally..

Pete

Post by **Godlover** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 3:52 am

suzib6sw wrote:My '86 is having similar issues at the moment..
Choke on.. crank for 10 secs..
Close Choke, no throttle.. crank and pops and splutters..
Bearing in mind that mine has basically stood since 03..
Anyway, faux tank off.. Open air filter (CAREFULLY).. Look inside and make mental note of whats in there and how its oriented..
There was/is originally a white plastic frame which held a paper filter and there are two plastic sticks with a U at both ends one longer than the other to help keep the filter in place against the top of the filter box..Get them round the wrong way and they WILL break.. No Biggie..
Other bikes have this missing but have some paper filter in there..
Take it out..
Spray carb cleaner or starter towards the rear of the box and crank.. No Choke and open the throttle slightly.. It will catch as the vapours get sucked in assuming the plugs arent soaked..
Then its just a case of getting the throttle in the right place and balance the choke and keep it running.. :-)

In my case.. Number 1 has issues till the bike is warm. Not sure why as I have had the carbs off, cleaned properly..and measured and balanced..
Once warm, there is an occasional misfire on #1 but the pickup on the throttle is instant and strong... Better than the '94 that I ride normally..

Pete

Does Carb cleaner work as well as starter fluid?

Sun Feb 13, 2011 4:28 am

WD40 has worked well for me in the past.

Post by **Godlover** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 6:57 pm

Figured out there no gas getting to the carbs. A bit of starter fluid and it fired right up until the fluid was done. I need to find the fuel filter!

Post by **Godlover** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 7:58 pm

I can see the fuel filter and fuel pump but I can't figure out how to get to it. I turn the ignition on and I don't hear it click. Is there a fuse just for the fuel pump? I wish I had a good manual!!!

Post by **Rhinestone Kawboy** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 8:38 pm

You may not hear a click unless the previous owner installed a non-OEM fuel pump. The fuel pumps on Voyagers (stock) only pump when the starter button is hit then only for I think 8 seconds or so. To check your fuel pump, open one of the carbs (or even two) drain plugs and drain any gas out that may be in there. When empty, then leave them open and hit the starter button for a few seconds at a time to see if gas runs out, if it does there is a good chance the fuel pump is working. If not, first check your fuel filter to see if it is plugged before attempting a fuel pump repair. Check in the AVA Tech Center under "OEM fuel pump reconditioning" to find out where the pump and filter is and how to service them.

Post by **Me Again** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 10:01 pm

Godlover wrote:Figured out there no gas getting to the carbs. A bit of starter fluid and it fired right up until the fluid was done. I need to find the fuel filter!

It's not uncommon for the fuel pumps on the XII to go bad.
It is also not that hard to fix.
Go to the tech center on the home page and you can find a description on how to repair a fuel pump.
A number of people have done the repair on the highway ,if that gives some idea how simple it is.

Post by **Godlover** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:58 am

Me Again wrote:
Godlover wrote:Figured out there no gas getting to the carbs. A bit of starter fluid and it fired right up until the fluid was done. I need to find the fuel filter!
It's not uncommon for the fuel pumps on the XII to go bad.
It is also not that hard to fix.
Go to the tech center on the home page and you can find a description on how to repair a fuel pump.
A number of people have done the repair on the highway ,if that gives some idea how simple it is.

Well, I spent this afternoon taking the fuel pump out! What a job! I have big hands so getting back in there to unhook the gas hoses was a pain. Then I forgot to clamp the gas line so I had gas all over the place. I took the pump apart and sanded the points - put back together again. I did get it hooked back up but not attached. I turned the key on and I still don't hear the pump click. Ugh! Not sure what I will do next. It was starting to cool down in the garage so I gave up for the night. I thank everyone for the suggestions! I'll get her running yet.

Post by **ekap1200** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:48 am

Hello Mark, Keep in mind that the fuel pump has two modes of opperation, first to get things going the pump runs off of the starter circuit. after that the pump has B+ to it and gets its ground from the coils neg side while running. How did the fuel filter look and also any gas that came out of the carbs. Did you drain it into a clean container to check for contaminents. Also a bike that is new to you, should have the plugs looked at and a good going over from front to back. Hope you get her going without to much trouble...

Post by **Godlover** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:54 am

I got the fuel pump off without taking the gas tank out. I should have taken the gas tank out! I may have to take it out so I can put everything back again. Gas flows out the filter and I don't think it is plugged. I will need to pull the tank to take the filter off - I didn't know that when I took the pump out. I really think it is the pump - I know I'm not getting gas. If I spray starter fluid in the intake it will start right up for a second or so.

The good news is I'm learning how to tear my bike apart!

Post by **David (N. Alabama)** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:51 pm

Godlover wrote:I got the fuel pump off without taking the gas tank out. I should have taken the gas tank out! I may have to take it out so I can put everything back again. Gas flows out the filter and I don't think it is plugged. I will need to pull the tank to take the filter off - I didn't know that when I took the pump out. I really think it is the pump - I know I'm not getting gas. If I spray starter fluid in the intake it will start right up for a second or so.

The good news is I'm learning how to tear my bike apart!

You do not have to pull the tank to change the fuel filter. You get to it by removing the coolant overflow bottle on the clutch side of the bike.

Post by **Godlover** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:54 pm

David (N. Alabama) wrote:
Godlover wrote:I got the fuel pump off without taking the gas tank out. I should have taken the gas tank out! I may have to take it out so I can put everything back again. Gas flows out the filter and I don't think it is plugged. I will need to pull the tank to take the filter off - I didn't know that when I took the pump out. I really think it is the pump - I know I'm not getting gas. If I spray starter fluid in the intake it will start right up for a second or so.

The good news is I'm learning how to tear my bike apart!
You do not have to pull the tank to change the fuel filter. You get to it by removing the coolant overflow bottle on the clutch side of the bike.

I thought about that - and loosened it but wasn't sure what all I had to remove to get it out. It does make sense so I'll look it over again!

American Voyager Association

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